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Cross & Gavel Audio

Explore a variety of conversations at the intersection of Faith and Law, with host Mike Schutt, director of the Christian Legal Society's Institute for Christian Legal Studies and Attorney Ministries.
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Now displaying: 2020
Oct 6, 2020

Join host Mike Schutt, Law Student Ministries Communications Coordinator Joan McElveen, Pepperdine 3L Reed Bartley, and law student leaders from other law schools across the country, as they share and discuss virtual meetings that work. 

Sep 29, 2020

Listen in on excerpts from our first-ever national Law Student Leaders' Summit, featuring an introduction to Law Student Ministries, an overview of Christian Legal Society's four ministries, an exhortation on the calling of the leader, and some questions and sharing by campus leaders from all over the country. 

Sep 12, 2020

On Wednesday, September 9, the Department of Education announced a new rule that will protect religious groups meeting on public university campuses. Kim Colby, the director of the Center for Law and Religious Freedom at Christian Legal Society, lays out why the regulation was necessary, and what it will mean for students. 

The Department's announcement is here

Aug 24, 2020

Join Drew Nelson and Mike Schutt as they discuss the insights and admonitions of Rod Dreher‘s 2017 The Benedict Option. The book has been widely discussed, and rightly so, in Christian circles since its publication, and, as Drew and Mike discuss, Dreher’s challenge to the Church to be the Church is a welcome one, regardless of the relative dangers of secular culture. Yet the book’s insights on that score are helpful, too, and Drew and Mike highlight Dreher's key insights on politics, education, and technology as they relate to his main thesis.

Andrew Nelson is preacher at Southside Church of Christ in Mount Pleasant Texas, and Mike Schutt is the host of Cross and gavel audio, the director of Christian Legal Society’s Law Student Ministries, and Clinical Associate Professor at Trinity Law School.

Jul 3, 2020

Kim Colby and Reed Smith of the Center for Law and Religious Freedom unpack the troubling Supreme Court decision in Bostock v. Clayton County, Georgia, handed down June 15. Justice Gorsuch seems to abandon his vaunted "textualism" in favor of a convoluted "literalism" with disastrous results. This is part three of three episodes discussing the important Supreme Court decisions of the last three weeks. 

Between June 15 and June 30, 2020, the US Supreme Court handed down three significant decisions of critical interest to religious conservatives. Colby and Smith join host Mike Schutt to discuss each case. Their conversation is divided into three episodes, one for each case. 

Episode 92 features Kim Colby on Espinoza v. Montana Dept of Revenue, episode 93 focuses on June Medical Services v. Russo with Reed Smith, and episode 94 unpacks Bostock v. Clayton County, GA, a particularly troubling case on the meaning of the word "sex" in Title VII. 

Kim Colby | Christian Legal SocietyReed Smith | Christian Legal Society

Kim Colby is Director of the Christian Legal Society'sCenter for Law and Religious Freedom, and Reed Smith is the Center's Director of Litigation.

Jul 3, 2020

Between June 15 and June 30, 2020, the US Supreme Court handed down three significant decisions of critical interest to religious conservatives. Kim Colby and Reed Smith, attorneys at the Center for Law & Religious Freedom, join host Mike Schutt to discuss each case. Their conversation is divided into three episodes, one for each case. 

Episode 92 features Kim Colby on Espinoza v. Montana Dept of Revenue, episode 93 focuses on June Medical Services v. Russo with Reed Smith, and episode 94 unpacks Bostock v. Clayton County, GA. 

Kim Colby | Christian Legal SocietyReed Smith | Christian Legal Society

Kim Colby is Director of the Christian Legal Society'sCenter for Law and Religious Freedom, and Reed Smith is the Center's Director of Litigation. 

Jul 3, 2020

Between June 15 and June 30, 2020, the US Supreme Court handed down three significant decisions of critical interest to religious conservatives. Kim Colby and Reed Smith, attorneys at the Center for Law & Religious Freedom, join host Mike Schutt to discuss each case. Their conversation is divided into three episodes, one for each case. 

Episode 92 features Kim Colby on Espinoza v. Montana Dept of Revenue, episode 93 focuses on June Medical Services v. Russo with Reed Smith, and episode 94 unpacks Bostock v. Clayton County, GA. 

Kim Colby | Christian Legal SocietyReed Smith | Christian Legal Society

Kim Colby is Director of the Christian Legal Society's Center for Law and Religious Freedom, and Reed Smith is the Center's Director of Litigation. 

Jun 9, 2020

Kim Colby, Director of the Center for Law & Religious Freedom, says that the Supreme Court will decide at least eight important religious freedom cases between now and next June. This term and next are "dream terms," she says, for religious freedom lawyers and court watchers.

In this episode, she highlights five of these cases, beginning with the "church re-opening" case, South Bay United Pentecostal Church v. Newsom, decided on an emergency appeal earlier this month ("I am concerned and disappointed, but not flipping out," she says of Chief Justice Roberts's concurring opinion). From there, she discusses the import of four major cases that have been argued or will be argued later this year:

  • Espinoza v. Montana Department of Revenue. She expects an announcement of the decision any day now, and she predicts a win for religious freedom;
  • Fulton v. City of Philadelphia, "an extremely important case" in which the Center filed an amicus brief;
  • St. James School v. Biel/Our Lady of Guadalupe v. Morrissey-Berru, consolidated and addressing an issue that tests the limits of the unanimous decision in the 2012 Hosanna-Tabor case; 
  • Little Sisters of the Poor v. Azar, featuring the order's third trip to the Supreme Court. 

Kim Colby

It's always a great time when Kim Colby visits Cross & Gavel. She is the director of Christian Legal Society’s Center for Law and Religious Freedom , where she has worked since graduating from Harvard Law School in 1981. She has represented religious groups in several appellate cases, including two cases heard by the United States Supreme Court. She has filed numerous amicus briefs in federal and state courts. Ms. Colby has prepared several CLS publications addressing issues about religious expression in public schools, including released time programs, implementation of the Equal Access Act, and teachers’ religious expression.

Visit the Center's website for resources on its first amendment work. 

Cross & Gavel is a production of Trinity Law School and Christian Legal Society. Mike Schutt is director of Law Student Ministries for CLS and Clinical Associate Professor at Trinity. 

May 28, 2020

Dr. Drew Trotter, executive director of the Consortium of Christian Study Centers, is a film critic who understands the role that movies play in shaping us as a society. His lecture, The Movies and America: What the Nominees for Best Picture Tell Us About Ourselves, is an annual favorite around the country. 

In this episode, Dr. Trotter sits down with host Mike Schutt to discuss the nominees for best picture. They discuss how we love our neighbors through watching movies, how to better understand what we watch, and the issue of difficult or graphic content in today's movies. They also consider what these nominees might tell us about ourselves. 

Drew Trotter is the Executive Director of the Consortium of Christian Study Centers. He was for twenty-two years the Executive Director and President of the Center for Christian Study in Charlottesville, VA. Drew has written on film and popular culture for over thirty years in such publications as Books & CultureChristianity Today and Critique, and in the field of Biblical studies. For over twenty years, he has presented a seminar entitled Show and Tell: How to View a Movie Responsibly, helping laypeople and students in churches, Christian college and secular university environments understand this powerful medium and how to think about its influence both on the individual and the society. He has taught seminars on popular culture, university education in America today, a Biblical model of discipleship and how to interpret the Scriptures. Drew has three sons, two daughters-in-law and six grandchildren and lives with his wife of forty-five years, Marie, in Charlottesville, VA. 

Mike Schutt is host of the Cross & Gavel Podcast. He is Clinical Associate Professor at Trinity Law School, Director of the Institute for Christian Legal Studies, and director of Law Student Ministries at Christian Legal Society. He is the editor in chief of the Journal of Christian Legal Thought and director of the CLS Law School Fellows program. 

May 19, 2020

Pastor Mark Bertrand has turned to the Psalms for his sermon texts during the global pandemic, and he joins Mike Schutt to discuss insights and encouragement from this rich source. You'll be encouraged as Mark explores how the "Songbook of the Church" speaks to us about lessons in crisis, sources of hope in trial, and the joys inherent in the life of faith.

J. Mark Bertrand is the pastor of Grace Presbyterian Church in Sioux Falls, South Dakota. He is also a novelist and author, and he teaches on the Worldview Academy faculty. His crime noir works are Back on Murder, Pattern of Wounds,and Nothing to Hide. His book [Re]Thinking Worldview: Learning to Think, Live, and Speak in this World (Crossway 2007) is a great primer on Christian thought and action. He blogs at the world-renowned Bible Design Blog, sharing thoughts and photos on a multitude of design issues.

His real claim to fame is that he was interviewed by Ken Myers on Mars Hill Audio Journal, volume 90, which also features Mike Schutt discussing Redeeming Law

Mark was also a guest on Episode 46 of Cross & Gavel, one of the most popular episodes in the podcast's history. More recently, he joined Mike to discuss the "New Moralism" in Episode 70 and law and government on Episode 73. 

Cross and Gavel is a project of Trinity Law School and Christian Legal Society.

May 5, 2020

Host Mike Schutt again welcomes East Texas preacher Drew Nelson to the podcast to discuss The Odyssey, Homer's ancient epic poem about . . . well, wait. What is it about? 

Mike and Drew explore that question and more-- including why good Christians should read good pagan literature and why you might like The Odyssey-- as they highlight its major themes and give some background to the poem. Their hope is that a couple of regular guys reading big books might encourage other regular folks to do the same.   

Drew Nelson is preacher at Southside Church of Christ in Mount Pleasant, TX, and Mike Schutt is host of the Cross & Gavel podcast, director of Christian Legal Society's Law Student Ministries, and Clinical Associate Professor at Trinity Law School.

Cross & Gavel is a project of Trinity Law and CLS.

Apr 24, 2020

Greg Rummel, President and CEO of Rummel Agency in Frankenmuth, Michigan, has a word of encouragement for us in this global pandemic: God's got this, too.

Listen in as Greg shares with host Mike Schutt how battling cancer helped hm to think well about living in difficult times-- and to focus on what is really important. You'll be encouraged!

Cross & Gavel podcast is a project of Christian Legal Society and Trinity Law School

   

Apr 14, 2020

"The efficiency brought by new forms of technology has just made us demand more of one another," says Myron Steeves, dean of Trinity Law School. "Our important innovations sometimes give us the opposite of what we desire."

In this episode, Dean Steeves and Mike Schutt explore the topic of technology and the tyranny of time. If advances in technology and greater efficiency in our lives don't make us better people all by themselves, why do we keep chasing them as ends in and of themselves? Is too much of a good thing still good? Join the conversation as they ask these questions and others! 

Cross & Gavel is a project of Trinity Law School and Christian Legal Society

Mar 31, 2020

Carl Caton is the founder and president of the San Antonio Marriage Initiative, a ministry focused on bringing help and hope to the city of San Antonio. Carl and his team, in partnership with volunteers around Texas, seek to network, equip, and mobilize the local church community to strengthen marriages in the city.

One of the organization's key strategies is to "identify best practices and resources" and to "collaborate with like-minded individuals who will deploy that knowledge throughout the local faith community." This, amazingly, includes the family law community. 

Listen in as Carl describes a vision for the family that includes reliance on the expertise of lawyers, judges, and others invested in the family law system. Carl also sees the need to minister to and encourage those attorneys and judges in the system, who see, day after day, the toll taken divorce and custody battles. His compassion for the legal professionals runs deep in his own history, and listeners will be inspired by his wisdom for those seeking to do redemptive work in this field. Carl Caton's message is a message of hope and redemption in a troubled world and profession. 

For more information on the San Antonio Marriage Initiative, visit their website

Mike Schutt is host of Cross & Gavel and is Clinical Associate Professor at Trinity Law School and director of Law Student Ministries for Christian Legal Society

Mar 14, 2020

Join host Mike Schutt as he welcomes local preacher Drew Nelson to the podcast to talk about the classic "On the Incarnation," by Saint Athanasius, 4th Century Bishop of Alexandria. 

As a young man, Athanasius attended the Council of Nicea and spent the rest of his life standing firm against the Arian heresy that remained popular, despite its condemnation by Nicea. 

On the Incarnation is a wide-ranging apologetic regarding the eternal Son of God taking on flesh to reveal the Father and save humanity. 

Drew and Mike read the book with their Wednesday morning men's group, and they report on their impressions. 

Drew Nelson in preacher at Southside Church of Christ in Mount Pleasant, TX, and Mike Schutt is host of the Cross & Gavel podcast, director of Christian Legal Society's Law Student Ministries, and Clinical Associate Professor at Trinity Law School.

Cross & Gavel is a project of Trinity Law and CLS.  

Feb 27, 2020

The CLS Law School Fellows program is designed to build a community of scholars around the topics of professional formation, vocational stewardship, and Christian jurisprudence. Each year, CLS gathers a group of students in Washington, DC for an intense week of lectures, mentoring, discussion, and fellowship. CLS pays the expenses of accepted candidates. 

In this episode of Cross & Gavel, Fellows Founding Director Mike Schutt discusses the program with CLS CEO David Nammo, Trinity Law School Dean and Fellows faculty member Myron Steeves, and two 2018 Fellows, Ronia Dubbaneh and Paulina Belovarski, who are both attorneys. 

For more information on the Fellows program, visit the website. Rising 1Ls and 2Ls should apply before midnight on March 1!

Cross & Gavel Audio is a cooperative project of Christian Legal Society and Trinity Law School. 

Feb 3, 2020

The Department of Education has proposed new regulations that are open for comment by the general public. Two sections of the new regulations are designed to protect religious student groups from being singled out and denied benefits because of their religious identity. 

Kim Colby, Director of the Center for Law and Religious Freedom at Christian Legal Society, summarizes the proposed regs and why they are needed. She also suggests that those who are in support of these regs should take action to comment in support of their final adoption.

Here are the regulations Kim addresses on the podcast:

Proposed regulation 34 CFR § 75.500(d) (§ 76.500(d) is essentially verbatim):

“A public institution shall not deny to a religious student organization at the public institution any right, benefit, or privilege that is otherwise afforded to other student organizations at the public institution (including full access to the facilities of the public institution and official recognition of the organization by the public institution) because of the beliefs, practices, policies, speech, membership standards, or leadership standards of the religious student organization.” 

The Center for Law and Religious Freedom has a guide to the regs and tips on how to comment at CLSReligiousFreedom.org/CampusComments. Here are the basic steps on how to submit a comment on or before February 18:

  1. Go to https://www.regulations.gov/document?D=ED-2019-OPE-0080-0001  (You are at the right place if the title is “Uniform Administrative Requirements, Cost Principles, and Audit Requirements for Federal Awards, Direct Grant Programs, State-Administered Formula Grant   Programs, Developing Hispanic-Serving Institutions Program, and Strengthening Institutions Program” and the ID No. is ED-2019-OPE-0080-0001.)
  2. In the upper right hand of the page, press “Comment Now.”
  3. Write your comment in the large blank space in the middle of the page (up to 5000 characters).
  1. At the top of your comment, type ID: ED-2019-OPE-0080-0001.
  2. If your comment is a document longer than 5000 characters or you want to include an attachment, type in the blank space, “I support the Department’s proposed regulations 34 CFR § 75.500(d) and § 76.500(d) for the reasons given in the attached comment” and upload the longer document or other attachment below the large blank space.
  3. Fill in your first and last name (or initial). Note that your name will appear on the public website.
  4. Hit “continue” to go to the next page.
  5. Check the small box indicating that you “have read and understand the statement.
  6. Hit “submit comment.”

Cross & Gavel Audio is a cooperative ministry of Christian Legal Society and Trinity Law School. Mike Schutt is director of CLS Law Student Ministries and the Institute for Christian Legal Studies. He is a Clinical Associate Professor at Trinity Law. 

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